I want to go faster.

Moderators: robnewyork, bassiclyLouDog, gameboy

By armysmurf
#2897
So I've got an razor E300 that I've been using to get to work and back. It's not bad but I would love to get this thing moving. I checked with the MPs on post and as long as I can keep it under 30 mph (or as long as I only drive it under 30mph on post) I don't have to register it. A buddy of mine is talking to me about switching to a brushless motor and using Lipo batteries. Now I have almost no experience with this kind of stuff but I'm starting to learn. Does this sound like it would work? And could anyone explain the difference between my stock E300 motor and a brushless motor and between the lead acid batteries and Lipo batteries. Also does anyone have any other ideas of how to speed this thing up.
User avatar
By bassiclyLouDog
#2901
I would keep it simple...sla's are run low, charge, run low charge. The controller stops the scoot if you run the batteries down to low, so that's all the maintenance you need.
A brushless set up done right is pretty pricey, but amazing results can be achieved. Check this forum, there is a brushless rig in PROJECTS that can do 50mph.
Lipo batteries require care, you can over charge them, you can't over drain them, they need balancing and proper cycles.
It's all in how involved you want to be. I've spent months of reading and trying things out. I don't have the best results, but I have a good enough grasp to double stock speed.
The quickest thing you can do is to add a 3rd battery in series. You have 2 in series for a speed of 12mph. 3 in series will give you a speed of 17mph.
round about-
controller/throttle $35
battery $18
charger $18
that's basic. You can also bump up the motor. 350watt $35, 1000watt $89
These motor require little more than drilling new mount holes and adjusting the brake cable around and cutting off the kickstand mount. All you can do with little effort.
Few things to consider- if you've used your batteries a lot I'd get all new ones because the 2 old ones will pull from the new one and weaken its lifespan.
and finally- increasing speed will decrease runtime. at 24v you get 30min, with 36v you get 15min, which is still like 4mi range.
By armysmurf
#2907
Sounds great. I can start off with that while I learn more about the lipo batteries and brushless motors. Where can I find out more about that kind of stuff? And where did you get the prices for those parts? When I looked up a 1000 watt motor it was well over 100. Obviously i'm looking in the wrong place.
User avatar
By bassiclyLouDog
#2910
tncscooters.com
monsterscooterparts.com

for parts like motors and controllers chains and such. They have the lowest prices.
By armysmurf
#2914
Ok so I think I may have rushed into the speed thing a little to quick. Sorry i'm a speed junkie but I realize now that I need to up the run time. I'm new to the elwctric scooter world but i'm loving it more and more each day. I have a number of questions but am a little afraid to ask cause they're probably basic knowledge to everyone else. Now I've been tring to research the whole battery thing and I've got the concept down on ah like how a 10 ah battry could run 1 amp for 10 hours our 2 amps for 5 but what determines whether your running at 1 or 2 amps? And how do you determine what controller to use with your catteries, motor, and stuff?
User avatar
By bassiclyLouDog
#2920
bassicly the controller is a gateway between the motor and batteries. The motor runs best at full speed. this is around 2650rpms. Adding another battery in series will increase the rpms to say 3100rpm. Things will get a little warmer, but won't hurt anything short term.
Without the controller batteries to motor, there is no way to adjust speed, so if your are stopped the motor is stalled and burning up from excessive amps trying to turn it. A typical 7ah battery can put out up to 100amps in burts. This is hard on the batteries and hard on the motor, so the controller is your buffer.
They come in voltages so that's the 1st thing you need to look at. the 2nd is thier amp rating. The stock 300 controller is 30amps. enough power to move you, but not enough to be hard on the motor.
(These are loose definitions of course as I am a newb as well)
48v 50amp controller for example is suited for larger capacity batteries such as 12ah.
By Squirrely
#5184
Just a Noob's two cents: It's really all about the age old conundrum which answers one question with yet another question, "How fast do you want to go? How much money do you want to spend?" My son and I JUST finished modding his stock 300. This was the first time he or I had attempted any such mods. I'd read this post to gather some 'lessons learned' but go to the pros for the expert advice.
Out of the box speed on a 300 is between 12 and 15 mph, uses a 24volt motor/controller/throttle and charger system. We took his to 48 volts, (4x12v/9aH batteries) a 48 volt controller, a 48 volt charger, 48 volt 5 pin throttle with led charge indicators and a 36 volt, 500 watt motor. Speed confirmed only by hand-held GPS is now 24 MPH for him (92 lbs.) and 19 mph (195 lbs.) for me.
Lessons learned: simply adding a 3rd battery is BY FAR the cheapest/easiest route but will not get you to 25 mph. Be sure to buy batteries that are the same PHYSICAL size as the stock 12v 7aH batteries. The best I could find with the exact same physical dimensions were 12 v 9aH. The increase in amp-hours does not translate to longer ride-time because the only reason you're doing any of this in the first place is to make the scooter faster. Going faster = quicker use of any aH gain.
Don't buy batteries online. Go to your local "Batteries Plus" or similar. They were cheaper and removed guess work regarding dimensions. To make room for all 4 batteries we had to stand 3 of them upright, as opposed to laying them down on their sides inside the pan (stock method) and create a metal riser that sets on top of the stock metal frame and lifts the deck about an inch higher than it used to be. Obviously, this means you have to buy new/longer (nuts, bolts, etc...) This is a bigger pain than one would think. All Razor hardware is metric and obtaining the correct size, thread tap, head bezel, length, etc... was difficult.
There are all sorts of methods out there for securing the 4th battery. I chose to fabricate a small metal box that bolts directly to the deck and right on top of the rear wheel well hump. I had to add some extra metal pieces for support. The stock frame/deck are not strong enough to adequately hold the 4th battery.
The new motor had a larger diameter than the stock by about half an inch. We got around this by buying the knobbied "off road" tires vs. the stock "slick" tires. This was a mistake. More research on my behalf would have led me to dozens of motors with similar power and output without the increase in diameter and length. Oh yeah, there's another hitch: whichever motor you choose, keep the dimensions as close as possible to the stock motor ( I swear this is possible and would have saved a ton of head-ache ). We had to saw off the stock kick-stand and it's mount so the motor and rear sprocket would align. We also had to re-route the brake cable. Additionally, the 36v 500 watt motor was probably not the best choice for top-end speed either. It added a TON of low end torque (a grown man can easily pop the front wheel off the ground by slamming the throttle all the way back) but if top-speed is your goal and I had it all to do over again, I'd go with a brush less.
The bottom line is that I spent far more money than required, did/re-did many things repeatedly but learned a lot and had a great time with my son. The scooter runs and charges perfectly. He gets about 3 hours of max-speed ride-time with no significant fall off in power until about 3 1/2 hours. The new electronics are flawless thus-far. I sealed up holes and gaps created by the new deck lifting frame with black caulk, made sure all the internals were water tight by using heat-shrink, crimp-on connectors jacketed in rubber, rubber grommets, electrical tape and even some hot glue. In the end, it was expensive, sometimes frustrating, did I mention expensive? But I can say without hesitation: I'd do it again. The scooter is a total blast to ride and it's fun watching the other kids with their stock scooters get smoked ( internally fun, of course).
By klystron
#5374
I have a new E300 I want to mod and I want to go the simplest route and just add another battery like Squirrely suggested. Can I keep the stock 24 volt controller and motor? or will 36 volts burn them out? Does anyone have any suggestions on the best way to do this? Also, I'm thinking of swapping out the stock 55 tooth sprocket with an 80 tooth which would give more low end torque. I like the ideas I've read on this forum but I don't want to get to complicated right away. Thanks for any suggestions.
By Squirrely
#5377
Yes, You can just add the 3rd battery. Many folks on these pages did so without buying a new controller, throttle, motor or anything else. The 24v stock controller seems to handle 36v without much hassle.
User avatar
By gameboy
#5551
hey Squirrely, do you have any pics of your kids mod. sounds great, bet it looks good too.
By billyboy999
#6309
Probably buy a vespa or something... a 40mph top speed would require some serious work (definitely brushless), and 2 hrs of battery life will bankrupt you in terms of lipos. Scooter is probably not the best idea for a goal like that. There are folks who've bought a bike trailer thing (like the baby carriages) and loaded it up with motors and batteries.
By mrstix75
#7187
Hello all!

This is my first post here so please forgive me if I desecrate any rules by posting here, I offer my sincerest apologies in advance! :)

I am a complete novice with electrical but I have a friend who has great experience and has offered to help me beef up my E300. If I order the parts, he will help me wire it up. So, what I want to do (like everyone else it seems) is increase the speed and low end just a bit. I have looked at all these ideas and I am a bit confused because again, I DON'T KNOW WHAT I'M DOING! lol...

In a nut shell I think I want to go to a 36v set up but I don't want to fry or melt anything. So here are the parts I am thinking about getting and I would like to make sure they will all work together before I throw down any cash.


Now I would love to use as much existing equipment as possible to cut down on cost, so will I need anything else to make this work? (Controller, charger, etc.)

Also, does anyone make smaller batteries? I would love to make this happen without it looking modified. I am great with the grinding, cutting, etc. I will be painting the frame and all that to try and make it a bit different than the rest. Your suggestions and guidance would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you all in advance for your help.
By robnewyork2
#7192
Getting a 36 v controller makes life easier..also the 350 w motor will make almost no difference.id keep the stock motor for now and run it at 36 volts with the new controller and batterys..when it fries if ever it will be cheap to replace i have 2 collecting dust..not toention the stock motor on 36 v will do 18 -mph as opposed to ur plan which will do 12
By robnewyork2
#7205
The 200 has a 200 watt motor and 30 amp controller..350 watt mayy be some gain in torque as a matter of fact..the amperage of controller could actually run 500 watts decently..for the bestcombo of speed and acceleration a 24v 500 watt motor would make the scooter a completely different animal...matter.of fact theres a my,500 w 24 v on ebay right now for 40 shipped as i recall...otherwise id just do the original idea with 36 controller and stock motor w 3 new batteries..Fri Mar 01, 2013 4:03 pm
By robnewyork2
#7207
I replied in the wrong thread..that link is live for a 500 watter 24 v for ,43 shipped.ill link to my ill placed replys ..what a mess
By mrstix75
#7257
thanks for all the info "robnewyork2". I think I will crunch the numbers but I like your idea of the slightly bigger motor. Thanks again.
By Mattrf
#9235
So been reading through these posts and decided that after riding my E300 twice now it needs to go faster. I think adding one battery sounded simple but I pulled the cover plate and I have two batteries lying on the sides and there is no room for a third. So how to you add a third or are there smaller batteries and you purchase three matched ones that will fit, if so a model number would be great?
Matt
By robnewyork
#9354
no , I mounted my spare 2 to the front post, and other ppl make custom traYS , custom trays look better, just lower ur tray with brackets about an inch and stand all 3 batterires upright.
By Nfg
#28675
Thanks for all this information
Q: can these batteries be cheaper batteries which are NOT Made by Razor? Will they definitely effect the performance of the scooter, or am I better off buying directly from Razor ? ( which is much more expensive)

Thanks in advance for the response
All this discussion has been a great help so far
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